ASIair with Rainbow RST135 mount issues

azskyguy

I just recently bought an ASIair which I use with my Rainbow mount. It's worked very well until the update to ASIair 1.3. Now the pointing of the mount is off by several hours. For example, if I point the point to Vega using the hand controller, it points far to the east, while Vega is overhead. If I point to M31, which is many degrees above the horizon, the mount indicates it is below the horizon. I'm on Rainbow firmware version 806. and there is a firmware update for the mount available. The mount pints perfectly without the ASIair connected to the mount.

Is anyone else with this mount having issues with the ASIair latest update to version 1.3? I'm running the iOS version on an iPad.

Thanks very much.

Mel Martin

Arizona USA.

w7ay

>> Is anyone else with this mount having issues with the ASIair latest update to version 1.3? I'm running the iOS version on an iPad.

Hi Mel,

First of all, check the time zone using the RST-135 Hubo-i hand controller. RainbowAstro's concept of time zone is messed up -- depending on the firmware version, it does not understand daylight savings time, although that shouldn't bother you in Arizona.

To exacerbate the problem, ASIAIR has no ability to read the time zone back from the mount (confirmed with ASIAIR QA), and the ASIAIR reports your time zone as being on the Greenwich meridian. A good check is to obtain a GPS lock on the hand controller, apply a long press of the ENT button to transfer the GPS time to the mount's "working" time, and then launch ASIAIR to see what it reports as the mount's local time - it should be the same as what your watch tells you.

A Sync To Mount (from a couple of iPad and iPod Touch models) does not appear to hurt the time zone setting, at least on iOS. But the displayed information is incorrect (I had suggested to ZWO that they at least report it as "Not available" instead of as "GMT.")

Check the telescope settings window and make sure the other fields (Latitude, Longitude and Local Time) are correct. If not, the date/time/time zone are the usual suspects when it comes to pointing errors. (Meridian flips were a nightmare until I found that the RST-135 does not grok time zones -- Korea does not have Daylight Savings time :-).

FWIW, I have only used the ASIAIR v1.3 *beta* in night skies. Our Oregon skies are not as forgiving as Arizona at this time of the year, sans your monsoon season (I stayed in Phoenix for a couple of years :-), so I have not been able to use the released ASIAIR v1.3 under night skies yet. However, when I used the object database in the released version of ASIAIR indoors, the RST-135 seems to point in the correct general direction.

In fact, ASIAIR 1.3 beta had been quite reliable that I no longer even take the Hubo-i hand controller out (one fewer item to carry, connect and tear down :-). I only use the hand controller now to set defaults and it goes back into the shipping box.

Be sure that you have updated the mount's firmware. The most recent one from RainbowAstro is V.190905 from back in the beginning of September.

Oh, another quirk with ASIAIR and the RST-135 ever since v1.3 beta. ASIAIR no longer complies with the four slew speeds that you have set up as defaults by the hand controller. Instead, ASIAIR now uses the 1x, 2x, 4x,... 256x, 512x and MAX (I guess so that the app itself is uniform across different mounts), but messing up the experience of RST-135 users.

Instead of the four speeds (which on ASIAIR v1.2 appeared as guide, fine, center and max), ASIAIR now uses Speed 2 (as seen on the hand controller) as its universal mount speed. So, Speed 2 is left at whatever speed was most recently used by ASIAIR. If you had set up Speed 2 as 100x as for manual use, you will need to re-apply the Speed 2 default to 100x again after using the ASIAIR (pain in the royal **** :-).

One more ASIAIR quirk: the Home button in the ASIAIR telescope settings window does work, but does not warn you that it has not yet reached home, in the case you started more than 90 degrees away from home (the 90 degree is the fail safe limit on the mount). So, if you apply the home key from indoors, you may want to do it a second time (blindly) after the first home operation finishes. (The home position is the safest position for the RST-135 when it comes to the backdrive problem of the harmonic drives, especially if the mount is in semi-balance in declination.)

After two local modifications, the RST-135 and ASIAIR make a really nice lightweight solution for me (I used to use a much heavier "lightweight" Takahashi EM-11.)

Cheers from the Pacific Northwest rainforest,

Chen

azskyguy

Thanks Chen.

I'll update the RST135 firmware tomorrow. I'm on 806 if I remember correctly.

The Mount hand controller had local time correct, and lat /long correct. Is there something else I should check?

The vexing thing is it all worked perfectly until 1.3 on the ASIair. On it's own, the mount points just fine. There had to be some change in the ASIair code to put me in this pickle. I really don't want to go back to my Windows laptop if it all possible.

I also liked the ASIair polar alignment routines, but after the update that doesn't work either. It plate solves around Polaris, then fails to move the 60 degrees. It just sits there.

I have some doubts if updating the RST135 will fix this, as it worked just fine until the 1.3 update from ZWO. At any rate, I'll look into your suggestions. And update the mount firmware but I don't see how that can have any impact. No daylight savings time issues here of course in Arizona.

Basically, what I'm seeing is when using the ASIair, all the positions of objects are moved Far East of their real positions. Seems like a time issue, but where is the issue originating.

Thanks very much for your thoughtful response. Love Oregon.. worked in Seattle for 10 years and enjoyed each trip to your state.

Mel

w7ay

>> It plate solves around Polaris, then fails to move the 60 degrees. It just sits there.

Hi Mel,

Everything that you have mentioned indicates something is messed up with the coordinate system between the mount and the ASIAIR (the two are not in sync). The mount did not move the 60 degrees during polar alignment probably because RainbowAstro thinks it is being driven below the horizon, while ASIAIR thinks all is OK.

Did you confirm that the mount's RA and DEC in the ASIAIR telescope settings window agrees with the hand controller's RA and DEC? Not just the Latitude, Longitude and time.

If an RST-135 firmware update does not fix it, you might try to do a plate solve in ASIAIR *and* sync the plate center to the mount before slewing the scope to where you want to start performing polar alignment. That, on paper, should make the ASIAIR and mount's coordinate system agree with one another. Unless of course they have recently introduced a bug when syncing the mount to the ASIAIR.

From v1.3 on, (probably because it is highly inaccurate) the ASIAIR no longer plate solves at high declination angles. So you will need to start from lower declinations, do a plate solve and only then slew the mount to where you want to start polar alignment.

Because of how tight the RST-135 adjustment bolts are located, I do my polar alignment at about 50 degrees east of the meridian so that after it slews west by 60 degrees, the OTA is clear of the altitude locking bolts on the RST-135 -- the ASIAIR does not have to start the polar alignment at the meridian. The 60 degree slew is just to solve for the center of rotation, so you can start and end at anywhere convenient -- it only uses the plates at the start and at the end (the FOV can even be obscured somewhere in between those extremes).

ASIAIR Beta 1.3 had worked properly for my RST-135 back on October 1 (with firmware 3.34), but the released version of v1.3 had also bumped the firmware to 3.37.

ZWO does not really do much regression testing, especially with our obscure mount, and they also change things *after* the beta test so I don't know if the released version of ASIAIR v1.3 has also stopped working for me.

I will try to do some indoor testing a little later with the released v1.3 and will report back if I notice anything odd. But the real test (especially with polar alignment) will need a dark sky. I guess my hand controller has to come out from hibernation :-).

Oh, I forgot to mention another oddness with the released ASIAIR v1.3. When you press the slew button in the telescope control mini-window in ASIAIR, it will switch the RST-135 into tracking mode !! But only the first time you slew. Once you turn off tracking again, further slewing will no longer turn tracking on. Definitely infuriating behavior. On ASIAIR v1.2, the slew buttons have properly left the tracking mode completely alone.

Best regards,

Chen

w7ay

Hi again Mel,

I just did a quick sanity check indoors.

Launched everything, with the RST-135 in its home (west horizon) location.

No plate solve or anything.

Asked ASIAIR to GoTo Venus, and it looks correct (slightly east of the meridian). Then did a GoTo to the Sun (appears as "Solar", the adjective for the Sun, instead of the noun :-), which is a little west of the meridian right now for me.

Upon a GoTo from ASIAIR, the mount went through a meridian flip and close to where I expect the Sun to be.

Since the ASIAIR cannot display the UTC offset of the mount, you might want to look it up in the Hubo-i hand controller. Long press on ENT from the home screen of the hand controller. Select Time and Date. On mine, it shows GMT-07.0 with the correct date and time. (And error in date could also throw off the reference coordinate).

If your UTC offset is incorrect, go to the field and change it, and then make sure the time is correct (or sync from GPS if you can see GS from indoors) after the time zone is changed.

Now, here is the most interesting part (even for my correct GMT offset) ...

When I went to the Hobo-i's PLNT list, both the Sun and Venus show that they are "outside limits" when I tried to do a GoTo from the hand controller! So the mount itself definitely thinks both objects are at the moment below the horizon.

Ouch!

What I did next is to go to ASIAIR's Telescope Settings window and pressed the green "Sync To Mount" button. After that, the hand-controller shows that both the Sun and Venus are now above the horizon and GoTo from the hand controller now moves the mount!

Moreover, after performing a GoTo Venus from the hand-controller, applying a GoTo Venus from the ASIAIR does not perceptibly move the mount (didn't hear any gears grinding). Looks like the ASIAIR and RST-135 are now in sync. But only after pressing Sync-To-Mount in ASIAIR.

So... try a Sync To Mount right after you start both ASIAIR and RST-135. No need to do any plate solve. See if it works.

FWIW, I had updated my RST-135 once, from an older one to v.190806; same as yours. I did not update to the latest because I don't run ASCOM and have no need for the automatic Meridian flip. So, you may also not require a firmware update (always a harrowing process :-). The firmware before v190806 was truly brain damaged, though.

Anyway, between the time zone and the Sync-To-Mount, things will work for you. I do miss the clear skies, but not the searing ("but it is dry heat," ha ha) temperatures in Phoenix.

Cheers,

Chen

azskyguy

Thanks again Chen.. you are most helpful.

This morning I hooked everything up and it worked perfectly. Was pointing (while inside the house) to objects in roughly the right place. So good so far.

My GMT offset is also -7 here.... (No DST).

Last night when things were falling apart the ASAIR app showed wildly off Lat and Long numbers... that was a clue of course....

Then this afternoon I tried it all again and could not connect to the mount at all in the ASIair app... thought it might be a cable, but it wasn't. Turns out the USB mode had been turned off and the handset. Maybe I inadvertently did it.. or some crazy glitch....

I didn't know the Rainbow could do a Meridian flip.. I'd probably like that... my big time Paramount does it with the right software. Does the ASIair provide meridian flip routines?

Anyway, will try it all tonight again... the folks at Starizona have done several firmware updates on the mount, so will let them do it. I'll sleep better.

Will let you know how it goes.....

Thanks for all your effort.... if you get down to Tucson way, let me know.

Mel